Kuwentong Pamamahay

Transcript in progress

Kathleen Zaragosa (KZ)

How you doing?

Jocelle Refol (JR)

I’m tired.

KZ

Yeah.

JR

How are you?

KZ

I’m groggy today. It’s feeling like Vancouver weather even though we’re in Toronto.

JR

Let’s do a weather check.

KZ

Yeah, sure.

JR

It’s currently 6:14pm. Eastern Standard Time. Six degrees. Cloudy.

KZ

That’s not so bad out here. Could have been negative six.

JR

Yeah it’s very gloomy today.

KZ

Yeah. Which is very apropo to revisit Vancouver feelings. So I can’t be mad at it.

JR

Yeah. Um, maybe we can share a little bit about where we’re currently based in Toronto. To paint the picture.

KZ

Sure. Let’s also say how much time has elapsed since we last sat down.

JR

Oh, yes. Good point.

KZ

Was July or August last year?

JR

I think it was. It was before you went to the Philippines. No, it was after. So August. Definitely August. Sorry. Yeah, definitely. August.

KZ

August was crazy then, because we both moved in August after that. Yeah. So it’s been what’s the math on that?

JR

That’s almost six months.

KZ

About six months. Holy cow.

JR

Wait, this is deeply uncomfortable. laughs together What do you mean it’s been six months?

KZ

Oh, no. We look very different, and we sound very different. And we are at very different places in our life now.

JR

For context. Kathleen no longer has bangs.

KZ

And you no longer have red hair.

JR

Yeah. Will we revisit that in the summer? Stay tuned in our 12 month check in. laughs again

KZ

Yeah, yeah. Well, we’ll have this be the cornerstone every six months or so to really ground ourselves. Yeah.

But going back to where we’re based in Toronto, I’m technically still in Toronto, just not in downtown.

JR

The entirety of like– if you even go into Scarborough, that’s Toronto, dude.

KZ

True. Okay.

JR

So you’re in Toronto, for sure.

KZ

Okay. So I’m firmly into or firmly. It’s just […] I know a lot of people who are based downtown that are like, you live so far away.

JR

That’s just people having this complex of living in Toronto center.

KZ

Yeah, yeah. So like, I don’t think I live too far away, but I do live on Woodbine. And that is pretty far on one end of the TTC. But it’s like, convenient enough. Like I live by the 506 [streetcar]. Like, just in terms of like, how accessible downtown still is to me. I still say that it is.

JR

You’re able to come here [to Jocelle’s place] in 30 minutes.

KZ

Yeah. Easy.

JR

That’s totally fine.

KZ

You’re one streetcar way. So it’s very accessible.

JR

Oh yeah, that’s also an update. We’re like, basically neighbors. Kathleen bursts into laughter No, we’re not, but we’re like distant neighbours.

KZ

That is a stretch for sure. Um, but yeah, where are you based?

JR

I’m based basically [at] Yonge and Dundas, which, for folks that may have never been to Toronto, is think about Times Square in New York, and think about the mini version of that. And what people immediately flock to when they come to Toronto is the downtown core, like by Eaton Centre. And so very different to where I used to live, which is interesting, because you basically lived in downtown-ish.

KZ

I lived a stone’s throw away.

JR

Yeah, like in Vancouver, and now you live in the suburbs. Versus I lived in the suburbs. And now I live in downtown.

KZ

Yeah, we swapped.

JR

Yeah. So it’s yeah, it’s been a very jarring experience of being by a mall, and basically living near a university that I don’t attend and just seeing different students. So yeah, that’s where I’m based.

KZ

Completely different makeup of the city.

JR

It’s crazy. laughs Like, I will walk to a different station, even though it’s like five minutes more, to avoid Dundas station because it’s so overstimulating every single day.

KZ

That’s so real. Yeah. Anything that you can do to just get away from the bustle of the city.

JR

No, for real.

KZ

So sitting down again for Kuwentong Pamamahay is actually I wouldn’t say it’s a discomfort for me currently. I think I’m just leaning into fascination at this point. Because knowing what we’ve been through in the last six months and knowing the experiences that we’ve had together, but then also the experiences we’ve had a part in our different master’s programs, and then also in our different social circles. There’s just so much change.

And it’s interesting to revisit Kuwentong in the way that, I mean, it’s always going to come back to questioning how we feel about ourselves, and then how we feel about community, and especially what we just went through last week.

JR

Oh, yes.

KZ

It’ll be, I think it’ll glean some really fascinating kinds of things to tie back into.

JR

Yes. And for those listening, Kathleen and I attended our first in person Pinoys on Parliament, which is the largest national Filipino Youth Conference in Canada. But since it is in Ottawa, it tends to mainly draw folks from the East. So.

KZ

Mainly people from Ontario and Quebec.

JR

Yeah. Even the Maritimes.

KZ

That’s true.

JR

No, Manitoba. So many people from Winnipeg, dude.

KZ

Oh, no, you’re right.

JR

So it’s literally just the east.

KZ

I wouldn’t even consider Manitoba the East, would you? Just because it’s east of British Columbia. But everything’s east of British Columbia.

JR

Oh my god, not us going into geography.

KZ

Yeah. I mean, regionalism is a real felt thing.

JR

From my understanding BC and Alberta are west. And Saskatchewan onwards, is east.

KZ

Saskatchewan onward? I would say that Saskatchewan and Manitoba are central or prairies, you know?

JR

I guess POP just attracts folks from the prairies and East mainly, I guess, in terms of accessibility. Because I looked the other day–

KZ

There is next to no people from BC, aside from us.

JR

Yes. Literally, because I looked the other day contemplating buying flight tickets home for Easter. And tell me why round trip was $600.

KZ

That’s gross. Absolutely not.

JR

You know? And then accommodation.

But yeah. Which question do we want to dive into?

KZ

Ooh. I’m leaning towards this middle one. What is your relationship to Filipino Canadian communities, and how do you access it?

JR

Yeah. So I guess when I arrived here, I really wanted to focus on settling in first. But since I met another Josel at a different conference, and she lives here, she really kind of just like, welcomed me into the Filipino community through a birthday party. Of her sister, like, who I had no connection with whatsoever.

KZ

That’s so lovely.

JR

But it was such a Filipino tendency to just invite, you know, extended people. And like, that’s where I met, like, my first introduction to different Filipinos in Toronto. And so I got to meet some of my closest friends I would consider, living here now.

And so for me, my relationship to like Filipino, Fil-Can communities is really just through like kapwa and kinship, and being able to see a sense of familiarity. It was always nice to walk around the streets in Toronto and be like, “Oh, my God, that’s a Filipino!” And trying to find a sense of familiarity. And then through extension of that, getting roped into like, laughing Filipino community work.

KZ

It always comes back around!

JR

I know, but granted that it’s not as extensive as back in Vancouver, which I do find peace in because it allows me to just relax and explore the city and find myself in it. It is nice that I can still, in some capacity, be involved in the Filipino community here and be able to see the potential differences.

But what about you? I’ll turn the other question over to you.

KZ

Um, my relationship to communities in Toronto, how I’m able to access them… I don’t think it’s as concrete as maybe your story is sounding so far. What’s fascinating though, is that it came to me first through music, I didn’t realize that– Well, for one, my entry point into meeting Filipino musicians in the city was a particular case for me, partly because my partner’s second cousin is a musician.

And that was such a particular one-on-one connection that I only, like I’d met her within the first month or two of being in Toronto. And then she’s like, “Oh, yeah, you should come to my show.” And then at our show, we’re meeting like at least three other Filipino musicians. And then I’m starting to get to know not just the music scene, but then also who is like doing things in very similar ways. I think music has always been a huge community building tool for me. And I’m sure we’ll get to the art thing in general in in a second as well. But it’s always so cool for me to see whenever overlaps. Because I realize that in my life that happens way more often than I give it credit for. And yeah, I would actually count that as my first in to finding community here with finding a certain kinship with other Filipinos.

Another one really quickly, and ironically enough, was actually going to the Filipino Catholic Church.

JR

Oh, yeah. You mentioned that.

KZ

Yeah, because I had gone for the first time with my parents, when they were here for a week helping me settle in. I wanted to take them specifically to this church, because it, they had marketed themselves essentially as like, “We are the Filipino Catholic mission.” It seemed like a church that was distinctly built for the community. So I was like, “Okay, we gotta check that out.” We don’t have anything necessarily like that in Vancouver, and we went to a 5pm Filipino [language] mass, they went full on, and they do that every week. So to hear that, and basically feel like Whoa, I got transported straight back to like Manila, or straight back to the Philippines. They’re singing all the hymns that I barely know, they’re singing all the parts of the mass, and I’m like, “Oh, my gosh, this is so immersive.” And that I actually barely understand anything that’s going on, but in in a good and strangely familiar way.

I went once more during Advent, leading up to us going home for the holidays, and I cried.

JR

Aww!

KZ

I had a whole thing where I was just like, I feel like my family is here. Um, yeah. And especially because I think in the way that I would answer this, even prior to leaving Vancouver– For St. Pat’s to feel like home for me was huge. And to kind of tap back into that feeling through going to the Filipino church here. It’s called Our Lady of Assumption. And it’s an hour away from me. I would commute and it was like a trek.

JR

What’s the intersections?

KZ

Up Bathurst. Bathurst and somewhere up north, maybe St. Clair? But yeah, it was a bit of a trek for me to get there. And I thought that it was worth it enough for me to tap back into that feeling. So that was maybe a second pull. Even though I don’t know particular people there, it was just the atmosphere. And just like the immersion of it, and knowing that, I’d seen my parents in this space and then I still feel them there and feel like my Lola there, somehow, even though she’s never been in that actual church.

There’s a spirituality aspect to it, where even though I still am navigating my own relationship to religion and being Catholic, I find that it’s still a strong feeling that I can depend on if I wanted to feel close to my family. I would know to go to church.

JR

Yeah, that sense of familiarity. Totally. Because like the church that I went to a couple here, it’s nine minutes away. It’s like a mix of people so I don’t see and so a lot of Filipinos so I can understand how like going to that church specifically can bring a lot of comfort.

But I also want to add, I totally forgot, access to Seafood City.

KZ

Oh my god!

JR

Because it’s a physical place and like making a trip out of it to go to Seafood City and then when I go there, at least– it’s been 10 years since I’ve been to the Philippines– but when I go there, it’s that immediate feeling of like, you see all the baked goods, you see all the Filipino workers, you have Grill City. I saw one day that random Tita leading Zumba in front of the cashier.

KZ

Real community programming happens in Seafood City. I love it.

JR

And so it’s crazy! And so that was such an interesting element. So I would be so fascinated if, you know, Seafood City was to be hopefully one day brought to Vancouver, what that would look like. But that’s a whole other thing we’re not going to get into, but I wanted to bring that up.

KZ

But I will say that if you have your association to the Philippines with Seafood City, my association with seafood city is going across the border. You know, like going to Seattle.

JR

Oh, yeah, totally. But I mean, in terms of like the vibes, the environment, it’s giving Philippines.

KZ

Oh, absolutely.

JR

That’s what I mean. Yeah, yeah. Because yes, border crossing the border 100%.

KZ

It’s just I wanted to shout that part out because it’s so particular to being Filipino in Vancouver for me. To like, leave Vancouver and then go to the States, specifically to access Jollibee and Seafood City that was the whole thing of my childhood.

JR

I feel like if we told our Toronto Filipino friends about that they’d be like, “What? What do you mean, you cross the border for Seafood City?”

KZ

Most definitely, like, are you absurd? Like, there’s no way like, why wouldn’t you have that there? And I actually get a similar reaction to like, “Oh, you don’t have Filipino language classes in BC?” Like you don’t have certain accesses to these things? Like, what? What do you mean? And it’s fascinating to make that comparison with other people who don’t know any different.

JR

Yeah, totally.

KZ

And I think a lot of that feeling was also very deeply felt at POP. Do we want to go into the dance thing? Because I think this is going to loop into the question of–

JR

–The practices and customs, traditions.

But yeah, like, also, we might have skewed data on this because other Josel definitely knows Electric Slide. But basically, what Kathleen and I “discovered,” is that there wasn’t as much enthusiasm for the Electric Slide, which arguably is one of the top line dances in the West Coast for Filipinos.

KZ

I’m biased, but that’s indisputable for me.

JR

Yeah, it’s totally indisputable. But when you were at POP, literally, everyone was dancing [Todo, Todo, Todo]. I’m really rough at it. But it isn’t my top choice. But tell me why, when I ran back in when we were about to leave to do the Electric Slide, our other friend didn’t know what it was. Everyone was just gathered on the side. No one was excited to go to the middle to dance Electric Slide. And I felt like a sense of– This is such a wrong use of this word, “otherness”. laughs Like, it’s not this is not correct use of it at all.

KZ

You felt “othered”.

JR

Yeah, but I felt like, I just felt really weird. I was like, what do you mean, you’re not excited about this? What do you mean, you don’t know the steps, or want to be like, oh, like, come teach me, show me. No, it was just me. It was me alone on the dance floor. And that was such a jarring experience that I’ve ever felt in a Filipino environment.

KZ

And I’m so sorry that I wasn’t capable of backing you up in that moment, oh man.

JR

That’s okay.

KZ

But um, yeah. Oh, it’s a hurtful recognition, I think, for both of us to come away from that night and being like, “Why does no one know Electric Slide? Like, I need to tell my mom about this!” Like, no one knows.

JR

And we went to collect data points? We literally went around asking people like, do you know this? Or at least are you, are you aware of it? Maybe you just don’t know how to dance it.

KZ

And the resounding answer being no is crazy.

JR

No-ish. Unless you look at the video like, “Oh, actually, I do know that.” But not knowing it off the bat? Yeah, that was weird.

KZ

Yeah. Because for us, our immediate reaction, it’s like a guttural reaction. Yeah, almost where it’s like..

JR

My soul is pulled into the dance floor.

KZ

Yeah, you hear the intro, and then you kind of just levitate straight there. You know? So it’s night and day.

JR

No, people were asking for Achy Breaky Heart. No one was asking for Electric Slide.

KZ

Ow!

JR

I know, I do enjoy the dance, but the fact that people were– I looked at the videos after everyone was dancing to Achy Breaky Heart, I’m like, “What do you mean? What do you mean?”

KZ

That can’t be it. Yeah. So that’s–

JR

Pain.

KZ

That’s the Bible truth that we are going to bring to the next dance floor out here. Yes. Um, but it is… I mean, the similarity that I felt resoundingly so throughout the conference was like, oh, wow, what brings us to similarities and like, what brings us in terms of the arts, and line dancing. And I know that eventually, karaoke was brought out that night, and it was just like, it was that… How do I describe this?

It’s not just the feeling of not having to explain yourself. It’s just, it was so explicitly and so directly Filipino, that conference experience, and getting to meet other youth who are at the same level to maybe understanding and at the same level of, I want to show up for this, I want to celebrate it. I want to meet you where you’re at. And just the depth, I think, that all of us there were trying to get to really made that conference what it was, it was so deeply impactful to be in a space like that.

JR

Yeah.

KZ

And it only makes me think of, I mean– because of our background of youth organizing, I guess, in Vancouver– why spaces like that don’t thrive as much for our age groups or for our peer groups in Vancouver the way that it seems so here?

JR

I think it’s because it’s so heavily institutionalized. I mean, permitted that a lot of the attendants were Filipino Student Associations [FSAs], there were still people beyond university that came. Right? And so I think a big part of you know, being a Filipino in Vancouver is like, for SFU, the FSA was only established in my last year of being there. At UBC, UBC is so far. So it’s like, if you’re a Filipino students there was more to access to you like Sulong UBC. And then maybe if, you know, you’re not necessarily like as exposed to like, Filipino activism, maybe you won’t join like groups like Sulong UBC, or Migrante or Anakbayan, right? Even there was Radio Migrante, right, at POP.

And so it’s like, I think it’s because there is Filipino spaces beyond institutions, from my perception at least, in Central/East Canada, that I think provides more opportunity for that.

KZ

It makes me think of barriers to access, or maybe just… I mean, this is a very general word, but the literal sense of organization and organizing, sometimes there maybe isn’t as much of an appeal to that. People just stick to, in my perception at least, people really stick to just like their family parties, and then just having that be it, having contentness in that. Which isn’t to say that that’s a bad thing. But it is just a very different sense of, I guess, like growing up in spaces like that, it always made me wonder like, there are more of us out there. I just never quite see it. And there’s never quite a unified sense of that.

JR

Two things with that. The first one, I think, from my understanding, the data shows that a lot of Filipino youth don’t tend to go to post-secondary, or they don’t finish. And so I think that also affects the ability for them to engage in FSAs, or have exposure or feel comfortable to engage with organizations, because it’s very intimidating, right?

KZ

Yeah. Because how are you going to be an FSA if you’re not a student?

JR

Yeah, exactly. And even with Collingwood Neighbourhood House, right? What brought people or like what brought Filipino youth there is because they knew people there. So if you don’t know anyone in organization, you are less likely to go.

The second thing being, reflecting on our time here together, the plethora of Filipino spaces that are outside of institutions. So BB’s Diner, we still have to go to Sari Not Sari. The Barkada Market. And then our other friend and I went to like another Filipino pop -p market. And the Ube Festival.

KZ

Ube festival was big.

JR

And even with Ube Festiva,l it brought not just Filipinos, but people of other backgrounds. And so I think really just the fact that, at least from my perception of being six months here, the opportunities to connect with Filipinos outside of institutions is so key. And I think that’s, for me, what’s lacking in Vancouver.

When I think about my entire life, like my 24 years in Vancouver, how long it took me to find Filipino community, versus how long it took me here. And maybe it’s because I feel more equipped, and more extroverted to be like, let me just connect with these Filipinos and more accepting of my identity that I want to go out to these things.

KZ

Like actively seeking.

JR

Actively seeking it. But also in Vancouver, it just took me so long to find what worked for me or feel comfortable to be in an organization. So I think that is also a big thing.

KZ

Totally, totally. I get the sense that the different places that you describe, they’re very much public settings. And makes me just think of like, physical presence in the city, like, that matters. And I know we talk about it a lot in Vancouver, just in terms of food places, but there simply is just so much more variety out here in Toronto. That it just makes it feel like there’s no barriers to access.

JR

Yeah, it’s not just about food here.

KZ

Yeah!

JR

I mean, like food becomes a central tenant to it. But there’s so much more and like, we’re like, we’re also based. I mean, you’re almost in Scarborough, but we’re also based in like, Toronto core. But there are so many Filipinos in Scarborough, in [Missis]sauga. Right? So it’s like, we haven’t even tapped into that yet. We’re only tapping into what is available here. Yeah. And there’s so many Filipinos up in North York too. There’s so many– We haven’t even been to like Filipinotown which [is] up by Bathurst, right. Like we haven’t even been there yet. Yeah. So it’s like the fact that we’re able to access this in proximity to where we are? It’s crazy to me.

KZ

Totally. Oh, man. And I think it’s, there’s been a very general understanding, even after not being here for so long, that Toronto just feels much bigger as a city. It’s like, three times the size in my eyes.

JR

It’s overwhelming.

KZ

Yeah, it’s huge. But then to be able to then see the amount of Filipino presence out here that is proportionate to that, yeah, makes that overwhelming as well. It’s like, if they can show up that much over that big of a city, then what more for Vancouver? Right? Does making it feel– I mean, not to call Vancouver necessarily a small town. But like, it kind of does feel like [a] small town almost like inferiority energy, where it’s like, does it feel like there isn’t enough space for us? Or does it just feel like we’re getting priced out all the time? Like, what is the barrier for us to keep showing up in these places, even for ourselves, even though it might seem like a selfish thing, or even though it’s like we want to see our parents’ generation, our grandparents’ generation, in spaces outside of church, or in spaces outside of the Catholic schools that we grew up in, or outside of the restaurants. There’s just so much more to it, that it could be that we’re now seeing and experiencing for ourselves out here, that I only wonder how, in what ways that can continue to grow in in Vancouver’s scene?

JR

Yeah. So much. Are there any other differences that you want to point out? I’m trying to think but…

KZ

Between the two cities?

JR

Mm-hmm.

Actually, I don’t have any personal experience with this. But it’s interesting to see the cross-solidarity here. I think for me, at least in my experience in Vancouver, a lot of the cross-solidarity has been between Filipinos and Chinese folks, but specifically in the context of like, Chinatown, hua foundation. But here, especially when I’m attending protests and seeing, you know, like Anakbayan speak at Palestine Solidarity actions. Or seeing collaboration between the Filipino and Tamil community. I find this so fascinating to see, this cross-solidarity and community making in that way. But I don’t have direct experience. But that is something that I’ve noticed.

KZ

Totally, there’s a, there’s a real sense of lateral support. Yeah, that maybe, maybe disjointed is the word that I’ve experienced in Vancouver in the past, and in previous works that I’ve done. Where it’s like, whenever they try to ask the question of why isn’t it working? You get the sense of like, people are maybe very insular, and like communities or like, focused on their own things.

Yeah, it keeps coming back to me as a sense of scarcity. Like the lack of space, but also just the lack of resources, but also just the lack of maybe mental bandwidth, because there’s already a lot thrown on people’s plates.

JR

And I think in Vancouver, it’s always the same organizations of people. Because our circles run so small. It’s so easy to refer to each other. But I don’t think I have a face of the Toronto Filipino community here. Because it’s so different. Because I mean, there’s also [Missis]sauga and there’s Scarborough and sure, I think it depends if you’re like in business and like, what field you’re in, or, but yeah, it’s hard to put a face versus in like Vancouver. There’s so many faces that are very frequent. Yeah.

KZ

Yeah, you get the same players, you get the same stakeholders.

JR

And so burnout.

KZ

Totally, totally. Yeah, I guess here. I hadn’t quite put it that way, but I think you’re right, where it’s just like, you don’t have to put a face to it. Because the presence is persistent. Because people are cycling out. It’s like there’s an ebb and flow to not just community organizing, but the way that the community shows up, period. It doesn’t necessitate the same people to do the same things. Which makes me wonder, is it a motivation issue that we face in Vancouver, or is it just, I don’t know, the passion of the very few that are going to bring us through?

JR

I literally think it’s structural things. I think it’s so much systemic stuff that prevents people from being able to engage. Vancouver and Toronto are equally expensive and so if you’re trying to survive, there’s so many other things that you consider. Are you really going to go out all the way to Collingwood if you want to do something? That’s why I mean, here, they also have different events in different parts of Toronto. But besides that, people just have to pick and choose what they can invest in. But yeah, such an interesting thought.

Do we want to wrap up? Do you want to end with the question of: H as the definition of home changed for you? Why or why not?

KZ

Has it changed for me? Um, actually, maybe it has. I’m going with a general sense that it hasn’t for me first, because I always resonate with the point of home is wherever I land. Home is within me, in a sense, and it’s like, oh, a knowing that I can carry with me anywhere.

JR

Yeah.

KZ

But the extension of that, as well, is home is in the people that I care about. And I know that by defining it that way, home is wherever my people are. Which makes me think that I’ve left home– It does feel like I’ve left home. By leaving Vancouver that that was a real rerouting and a real settling period that I had to go through in those first few months of Toronto. But living alone, I think, has changed my definition of home. Because there’s literally no people to be living with. So there’s just that sense of like… Yeah, I think I’ve really honed, words, I’ve really honed the sense that home is something that I get to build for myself. And something that I get to it’s almost a non-answer, but home is what I define on my own terms. And it’s a comfort level. And it’s a freedom to just vibe. You know? Like it’s just, I can do whatever I want when I’m home.

JR

It’s like I love my parents, but I don’t have to report to you what I’m doing when I’m just vibing.

KZ

Yes, yes. And also, literally to that point, because I don’t live with my parents anymore, specifically, I don’t have to report. I don’t have to paalam. And getting to renegotiate that boundary feels more like I’m reclaiming home for myself.

JR

I love that. And I really resonate, too.

I will say in terms of built environment, there are parts of Toronto that will never just feel like home in terms of the lack of greenery. And I think whenever people ask me, “What do you miss the most?” I’m like, I miss the mountains. And I miss– no offense to Toronto trees, but Toronto trees aren’t it.

KZ

laughs

JR

Like, what is a Toronto tree? Okay? Disrespectful. They also put them so far apart from each other, you got to put them together, trees like when they’re together. Sorry, that’s a very nature answer.

But um, yeah, like, there are parts of Toronto that will never feel like home because there’s no mountains, because there’s no greenery. Because access to water is huge for me. The fact that I have to walk 40 minutes to the waterfront, to just be able to see water. I haven’t seen water in so long, by the way. Oh, wait, when we went to Ottawa. That was the first time I saw water in months.

KZ

True, walking by the river. Yes. Oh my god, in months?

JR

Crazy. Yeah. Obviously water that’s not drinkable, in terms of bodies of water. So that part will not change in terms of how I define home.

But in other ways, I do feel like the just like the network that I’ve built, has felt so homey, and makes me feel so comforted, seen and loved. Even being in Ottawa, being in our friend’s apartment, felt so homey. Even though it wasn’t my home. I felt so welcomed. And I think it’s just, the element for me– I think my previous answer was like, my home is where the people are, and not a physical place, which I think still rings true for me. But I think in addition to home is the feeling of being cared for. That really has arisen from me moving out. Even if I’m living by myself, I still have roommates and I take care of myself, I cook for myself. I clean, make sure my space is clean and cozy. I feel like that has really helped me further define what home means for me, for sure.

KZ

The feeling of being nurtured by the people that you care for. Yeah. I’ve never felt hospitality to this depth. Now that I live alone and now that I have to fend for myself in very real ways. The hospitality feeling is something I can’t take for granted, or I just know it at a deeper level now, because whenever I welcome someone into my home, that’s exactly the feeling that I want to give. And that’s exactly the feeling that I think we’ve received from whenever we get hosted. So it’s a real shout out to quite literally the homies.

JR

We love our homies.

KZ

Yeah, they’re so great out here. And even just like that part that you said about feeling welcomed. There was like an instantaneous feeling to it. There was no warm-up.

JR

So instantaneous, you’re so right about that.

KZ

Yeah, just the speed to which you already know that you care for each other in those ways, was… That’s impacted me more here than I think anywhere else I’ve been.

JR

Oh my gosh, me too. And like, it’s crazy because there are parts of me that are like, girl this is temporary. laughs In terms of perspective of life, there are ebbs and flows of people that will be in your life and will eventually, you’ll be disconnected just because of reality. But it’s been so nice to be able to sit and be present, being like wow, I can’t believe I have this network at this moment. And how incredibly unique the situation in my timeline is. Like, for example, you, me and Jestinne, the cutest trio ever.

KZ

We love this trio!

JR

And like just like the way that that’s aligned and like, created a sense of home in such a unique timeline. Like this will never, literally never happen again. Just being real, but like, it’s so cozy and homey to think that way. And I’m just trying to bask in the fact that this is here.

KZ

Yeah. Oh, there’s a whole sentiment around the way that we’ve been able to share in this experience together, not just because we’re from Vancouver and because we had our friendship background to begin with, but particularly because we get to share in this experience.

JR

Yeah. And because we’re Filipino!

KZ

Yeah, and we don’t have to explain ourselves. We just get it, you know?

JR

And it’s easier to connect to other people who are Filipino. It was really strong. It really showed how we literally uprooted ourselves, put ourselves in a new city, and still connected with Filipinos. It just really shows that connection.

KZ

Shared roots.

JR

Yeah, it’s crazy. This was an experiment. We were the experiment.

KZ

We are our own social experiment and we are researchers in training.

JR

For Kuwentong, this was the experiment.

KZ

Most definitely. And I think we’re thriving. Gotta say.

JR

Yes. Aside from grad school, yeah.

KZ

Grad school will feel thrive-y once it’s done.

JR

Yeah, totally.

KZ

Yeah. A good degree as a finished degree.

JR

That’s a great way to end it.

KZ

And with that, we are done our follow up.

JR

Thanks Kathleen!

KZ

Thank you, Jocelle!